Hi
Just starting a thread for Ukkonen photos.
Tasmanian Oak
Just starting a thread for Ukkonen photos.
Tasmanian Oak
Ukkonen AWG Photos
- Thread starter Alan March
- Start date
Tasmanian Blackwood
Candy Red
Cobalt Blue Metallic
soon
soon
Yes, ported design
SmartOne_2000
Active member
Alan, I've never seen a slit like yours used as a bass port of sorts. Can you explain the advantages/disadvantages of having a slit vs standard oval ports for bass reproduction? Is it better SPL, distortion, frequency extension or something else?
Holmz
Member
They are pretty common for transmission line style of folded ports.
I wouldnt say they are common, but they are certainly about. Ports dont have to be round. They just need to be able to flow the requisite mass and velocity of air without undue turbulence, and of course be tuned to the correct frequency. There is no particular advantage to slot ports, however in our designs they work very well in terms of placement and cabinet construction.
Also we have configured them so that they dont leak frequencies outside of their range like many designs do.
From an Ukkonen review
SmartOne_2000
Active member
So, maybe with a taller slot, can you can further extend the lower frequency response from Graph 1 to be flat down to 20Hz or below? Does graph 1 include room gain?
This speaker only has 1 woofer but the Sointuva bookshelf has 3 for almost similar frequency response. With added room gain, these frequency responses should be almost identical. Is this a fair assessment?
This speaker only has 1 woofer but the Sointuva bookshelf has 3 for almost similar frequency response. With added room gain, these frequency responses should be almost identical. Is this a fair assessment?
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The Aus Hifi measurements are quasi anechoic, so no room gain. Their technique isn't as accurate as a Klippel NFS. They show its only a couple of dB down at 20Hz.
I dont think you will find another speaker in this class, or even vaguely close in price that manges that sort of low frequency extension.
Tweaks to the port would be more aimed at reducing the minor peak at about 50Hz, as this is more audible than anything happening at 20Hz, but this would also have the effect of slightly increasing the output lower down.
I dont think you will find another speaker in this class, or even vaguely close in price that manges that sort of low frequency extension.
Tweaks to the port would be more aimed at reducing the minor peak at about 50Hz, as this is more audible than anything happening at 20Hz, but this would also have the effect of slightly increasing the output lower down.
SmartOne_2000
Active member
Ok, so it should be lower dB at 20Hz per your specs than is shown by the quasi anechoic measurements. Is adding more woofers a possible option to resolve this issue in the future (and possible improve efficiency) or would the 6dB of room gain make the response flat down to 20Hz?
There is no issue. Why are you concerned about -2dB at 20Hz? Which would be more than compensated for by room gain. Most speakers dont manage that level of flatness in their main frequency range.
You can add more woofers. That will make it more expensive. Is there any need? Does the market want it?
No, the Sointuva only has 1 woofer. The rear devices are passive radiators. They serve the same purpose as a port. We use them in that design because parameters of that woofer would require a very long port that is difficult to fit in that size of cabinet.
The sountuva, whilst having possibly the most extended low frequency response of any speaker of that size, does not go as low as the Ukkonen. Even with room gain. Plus it won't play as loud with more limited woofer displacement at the lower frequencies
SmartOne_2000
Active member
When you wrote that Aus HiFi measurement technique was not as accurate as the Klippel NFS, I assumed their measured FR plots were not accurate , that their -2dB @20Hz measurement was not as accurate. Your specs say it's 10dB down (F10?) at 22Hz.
1) Is room gain able to flatten it out to +/- 1dB or better at 20Hz?
2) With such a low frequency extension, is a subwoofer necessary in 2-Channel or MCH setups? I'm not including media (movies) with deep subsonic frequencies?
3) These European monitor speakers, as reviewed in Audioholics, are priced the same as the Ukkonen ($5,900), but definitely not as pretty (as the candy red version) have similar performance. How do you think they compare?
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SmartOne_2000
Active member
Well, more is better (typical American psychology)
!
We need to revise the published spec , it is very conservative and taken from the initial modelling. Our measurements are closer to the Aus hifi data.
1. That depends on your room and speaker positioning.
2. Not for music. As an aside subs are far more difficult to integrate properly than people imagine. A single sub never works well. You need 2 or preferably 4 to help mitigate the room modes and smooth the response out in different listening positions. Plus a good dose of DSP.
3. Well, TBH you need Klippel data to form any reliable conclusions, but their bass obviously isn't anywhere near as extended. -12dB at 20Hz. So they really dont have similar performance.
Again you need data based on the CEA2034 standard to see things like sound power, directivity index smoothness and predicted in room response.
Take a look at Erins Audio Corner to understand speaker measurement.
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Holmz
Member
The Sointuva seemed to go plenty loud in your room, and bass was surprisingly “there”.
I don’t now how they need to be played, but my NIOSH app was telling me that the time and level would make for a finite amount of listening.
@SmartOne_2000 how big is the room that you are considering that the speakers would go into?
It was a small room. Also, if you want to play really deep low frequency bass the woofer excursion starts to become an issue. These are all part of the reasons why the Ukkonen will perform better at the lowest frequencies